27 Responses to “The Coming Collapse of the Middle Class”

1. ll Says:
   May 3rd, 2008 at 08:06 PM

   Appalling is all I have to say. So sad this is happening…

2. misha Says:
   May 3rd, 2008 at 10:13 PM

   happy first mothers day and so many congratulations. You have a quite sexy little boy (and not in the sick way) I think all my pets are sexy beasts :)

3. Marta Says:
   May 4th, 2008 at 01:18 PM

   I just wrote 4 sentences myself and deleted them. I think that’s because this lecture makes my brain think more thoughts than I can process and disgorge. I will say, I find it heartbreaking that my takeaway is “get out in front and fight for me and mine – stay healthy and hustle to keep my head above water.” I’ve always maintained that my personal beliefs cornerstone is to do what’s best for the greater good. But having seen myself in so many of those statistics, I want to make sure that I come out of this alive. So maudlin of me, but those numbers inspired such a primal feeling.

   Also, I want to punch every baby boomer in the face who’s ever said anything approximate to, “Oh, I remember. I know what you’re going through. It was hard for us, just starting out as young people.”

   $&^#%$(@)!* YOU BOOMERS.

   My husband says we should all band together and everyone with health insurance should cancel it, wholesale. A sort of nationwide insurance-out. I wish I could figure out how to motivate everyone to do it. That would be awesome. Take that Blue Cross.

   Thank you for sharing that. We watched the whole thing and plan to share it. I’m glad post 11 survived.

4. mihow Says:
   May 4th, 2008 at 02:05 PM

   Marta: You just started a household discussion over here. I thank you for your comment. You’re so right about the baby boomer generation. Yes, they had it hard, but try it now! My folks are seeing it a bit as we try and find a decent and affordable place to live. They’re seeing how hard it is.

   And regarding the cancelation of health insurance? Wow. hahahah That’s an interesting idea to ponder.

   The speech really does render me speechless. Ironic, eh? I feel totally incapable.

5. kate anderson Says:
   May 4th, 2008 at 09:35 PM

   Uh, I think the woman who gave the lecture is a baby boomer, Marta. Winning the argument on who has/had it the hardest is probably not the point. In this election season, it is vitally important to fight for the candidates that will fight for you and your interests. That is where a win will count.

6. kate anderson Says:
   May 4th, 2008 at 09:35 PM

   Uh, I think the woman who gave the lecture is a baby boomer, Marta. Winning the argument on who has/had it the hardest is probably not the point. In this election season, it is vitally important to fight for the candidates that will fight for you and your interests. That is where a win will count.

7. Sandy Says:
   May 5th, 2008 at 01:50 AM

   As a baby boomer, who has kind of made it through (I’m 56), these things are scary. Most of the time we raised our 4 kids on one (not very high) income and we were pretty poor (my now grown kids still live by the model that you have one pair of shoes and you don’t get another until those wear out and just because your sister got one does NOT mean that you do) But you could buy a house (we bought our current one in 1987). But, even still, you’ve got to keep your family intact and healthy if you are going to make it through. One thing she did not talk about was retirement. For myself, if it was not for inheritance we would be looking at being old and poor.

   But when I was young and starting out, things looked bleak too…...

8. rachel Says:
   May 5th, 2008 at 02:35 AM

   this is crazy. I am trying to get a line of credit just as a safety precaution in the event something goes in the house. I am thinking of cancelling it. It also forced me to do a budget. I need to start putting money in savings and start up my 401k again. Christ. Come live with us. Then we can all be debt free and stick it to the man. We will put solar panels up and buy a hog and cut up our cards and go off the grid.

9. Marta Says:
   May 5th, 2008 at 04:17 AM

   Oh goodness… it’s 1AM here on the West Coast and I’ve not not had something to drink. But really, are we gonna have a generational pissing match (my dad’s expression) now? I will just say the idea of having 4 kids sounds like a luxury to me as an almost 30 year old who has no idea how she’ll finish scraping together the down payment (for you scorekeepers, 20% is about $60k in one of the only towns where my husband and I are employable). I’d like to have one kid before all my eggs disintegrate.

   I really did appreciate Warren’s explanation about how we’ve all been able to ignore these dire happenings. I think that’s what’s most germane about this whole thing: people need to pay attention.

   And @rachel, I’m in! I grow a mean tomato. Alright, fine. My husband grows them. But I make the caprese! Oh! We’ll get goats too and substitute goat cheese for the mozzarella (cows scare me a little and the methane… I’m a nerd for the Earth)!

   P.S. My house figures basically apply to a tear down in an “up and coming” neighborhood. The gangs are LESS active there. Huzzah!

10. Mel Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 09:52 AM

    I watched this with my husband, who is a PhD history professor. He says that when baby boomers were starting out, the economy was much more solid and things actually weren’t as bad overall as they are now. He said that in recent history, the 70s were the worst economically, but that our economy in 2008 is almost if not as bad.

    A couple of years after my husband got his first full time teaching gig, his dad’s advice was to put every pay raise into a retirement account. He told his dad that would be great, but the cost of health insurance increases were eating up his pay raises and then some! His dad, who was able to save over a million dollars for retirement on a state government administrator career, just couldn’t relate to that.

    I stayed home with my kids until almost two years ago when the cost of health insurance forced me to get a full-time job with benefits. I can’t qualify for private insurance without all of my pre-existing conditions being uncovered. My salary is decent, but the health insurance is why I’m working. And I’m lucky that I was able to hold out until my kids didn’t need day care or after school care.

    We both have good retirement plans with our employers, but our big worry is sending our two kids to college. Sigh…

11. mihow Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 10:22 AM

    I think what Marta meant, Kate is that she knows of people personally who are baby boomers and bitch and moan about how hard it was for them back in the day. I know the type.

    Also, regarding voting this year. I hear what you’re saying, but this is even bigger than who we vote for. No president can make the changes we need. This needs to be done on a local level, by the people. Groups of people in towns all over the states need to put their money where their mouths are and make change. Sure, voting is unbelievably important, but a president doesn’t really have the power to really make change. There’s too much bureaucratic red tape.

    For starters, instead of protesting the olympics in Beijing, how about we actually stop buying ALL things made or associated with china? How about we stop supporting cheap labor and bring jobs back home again? How about we revitalize small town USA? How about we bring back small business? How about we allow people to make a living, support their family, send their kids to a decent school without having to commute 1 hours 40 minutes to do so? What happened to small towns? I could go on and on about this topic — how completely messed up things have gotten — but I just sound like I’m whining.

    I seriously want to see change. We need to make a difference and I think that difference comes the American family. Individuals need to stand up and make changes.

    Totally different subject, but health problems (I think) are going to get continually worse for younger people because of what we’ve done environmentally. More and more toxins, more and more pollution, more and more large pharmaceutical companies selling more and more drugs to treat symptoms instead of us trying to figure out ways to prevent them.

    This means more and more people are going to face more and more financial difficulties. We’re not going to a great place. We need to change. And I don’t think a president can singlehandedly do such a thing. I know that seems like an easy fix, which is why so many people are drinking the Obama camp Kool Aid called “CHANGE” (not that I’m not all for it, btw). It’s going to take a whole hell of a lot more than voting on a slogan.

    Wow, I’m totally ranting. Shit, sorry.

12. Mel Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 12:16 PM

    Mihow, I understand what you’re saying about boycotting products from China. However, if you recall from the video, she said that most consumer goods are more affordable now than they were 40 years ago because they are cheap foreign imports. It would take a long time (40 more years?) for an economic shift back to most of our goods being made here. And when people have so little disposable income, it will be hard or maybe even impossible for them to buy more expensive domestic products.

    More on this type of idealism: in the small town that I live in, there is one Walmart and there is one regional chain grocery store. I would love to buy all my groceries and household goods at the grocery store, because I hate Walmart. But I have to spend 15 to 20% more at the grocery store. I would like to give my kids organic milk, but we go through about a gallon a day, which equals over $100 a MONTH that I’m spending on milk alone. What I’m saying is, I can’t afford to be idealistic, and from what I learned in the video, I’m not alone.

13. mihow Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 12:33 PM

    How many of the consumer goods are necessary items? I wonder. I’d be curious to hear how many of them are needed.

    Plus, I think that if more people started buying locally (if they can, and most probably can if they take a closer look at their budgets) goods will become cheaper. I feel the hidden costs behind importing everything are far more dangerous than having to pay a few extra dollars to buy locally. Keeping your dollars as local helps everyone in a given community.

    For example, WalMart regularly sets up shop outside of town, avoiding having to pay local, city taxes. That hurts a town. Dare I suggest that in the end it’s more detrimental than spending a dollar more on something grown or produced locally? (Instead of shipping profits to Arkansas — walmarts home base.) They are infamous for not paying health insurance to those working less than a certain number of hours a week, yet (if I recall correctly) they don’t allow most employees to work more than that number of hours a week. It’s a viscous cycle. Personally, if it is possible, and I think that for many it is, I’d say buy as local as possible. Hit the farmer’s market, buy milk from local farmers.

    Organic milk, however, is one thing I will never ever not buy. I can’t imagine pumping Emory full of those hormones. If I have to skip the wine, a gallon or two of gas or the next pair of my shoes to buy him some organic milk, I’l do it. I’ll do whatever I can to make sure he eats well. Better than me even. I just can’t support these giant, commercialized dairy farms. They frighten me so.

    This is a topic I love and hate to have, especially online. My points are half assed and I never want to upset anyone. So, if anyone out there feels irritated by anything I write here, then chances are I’ve not explained myself well enough.

14. mihow Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 12:43 PM

    Also, is it safe to assume that the reason food is becoming more and more expensive right now is partly because of the amount of fuel used to ship it from one place to another? What if we hadn’t put so many farms out of business due to our need for making meat, milk, etc so damned cheap by commercializing the hell out of it? Have we gone over the hump of where something that was once conveniently cheap because it was mass produced has become more and more expensive because of the amount of gas needed to get it to where it’s going? Is non organic milk slowly reaching the price of a local farmer’s organic milk?

    Am I making sense?

15. mihow Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 12:53 PM

    You know? I wonder how many families now will have only children because it’s far too expensive to have a bigger family now. We probably won’t know that for several years, however. I can buy organic milk right now because I only have one little guy.

    Also, a lot of my comments are fueled by Animal, Vegetable, Miracle which I am just finishing up.

16. worker Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 01:17 PM

    It’d be a lot easier to afford everything if first time homebuyers didn’t have to buy “fixer uppers”. The amount you spend in maintenance alone is all the organic milk, fresh produce, whatever you could have buy.

    She mentions that in the video. McMansions aren’t for new buyers. They are for 3rd and 4th time buyers. Affordable first time homes without hundreds of problems might be the answer.

17. Sandy Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 01:40 PM

    Just for the record….we did not intend to have such a large family. We adopted two children and then had two spectacularly unplanned pregnancies. So you just never know!

    One difference now from 30 years ago is that neither my husband nor I nor most people we knew…had any debt. There just wasn’t the expectation nor the ability to rack up big debts.

    Our first house was 750 sq ft…in ok shape, wasn’t really a fixer but did need some work. Cocaine dealer/rapist plus several folks in and out of the mental hospital lived across the street….

18. mihow Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 04:41 PM

    My God, I hate the way I sound sometimes. The organic milk comment above sounds snotty and pretentious. Believe me, you, I am no saint. I’m filling my son with poison from the BQE and NYC, and NJ. this place is covered in trash. I hate that I wrote that about milk. We do drink organic, but holy crap! to get away from this polluted area, I’d give up organic milk and feed him whatever to trade off. heh

    Sorry, guy. I get all crazy when i discuss stuff like this and animals.

19. sally Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 06:04 PM

    I’m sure you don’t want to move to Phoenix, but there is a non-development, development you would probably like.

    http://www.agritopia.com/

    You don’t need to apologize for your wanting to live in an area not dominated by environmental issues.

20. sandy Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 06:36 PM

    Don’t sweat the small stuff. The most important thing for Emory is that he has two parents that love him and who will care for him and keep him safe. That is the most important thing. More important than organic milk.

    You live where you live, it doesn’t matter so much. Maybe it would be better if you lived in another town or had more money….

21. katie Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 09:49 PM

    Ironically, corn is a major cause of rising food costs. It is used in so many products and used as feed for those dairy cows among other animals. Now we are utilizing corn for ethanol so demand is extreme. As for the election season, Mihow, I fully mean to get involved in any possible way on the local level or wherever your concerns take you. Yes, the presidential election is important but your school board, your city council, your state reps will be casting votes about taxation, tax breaks, health care, clean water, a myriad of social issues etc. Gots to get involved people!!

22. Marta Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 10:58 PM

    I’m a huge believer in the importance of people getting involved in the political process, but at the risk of seeming sycophantic, I gotta agree with Mihow: this is bigger than an election, even one as important and energizing as this one. The situation really does require a revolution.

    But how?

23. Marta Says:
    May 5th, 2008 at 10:58 PM

    I’m a huge believer in the importance of people getting involved in the political process, but at the risk of seeming sycophantic, I gotta agree with Mihow: this is bigger than an election, even one as important and energizing as this one. The situation really does require a revolution.

    But how?

24. keith Butters Says:
    May 6th, 2008 at 10:16 AM

    The thing that really gets me about food costs is the fact that there is still a HUGE set-aside program in the US. So there’s plenty of farmland available to increase the supply of food (thus lowering prices), but our government pays farmers to not grow anything. It’s not ethanol’s fault, and i don’t think it’s trucking/shipping (too much). I really think it’s a question of supply and demand. We know some people in Iowa with farmland who haven’t grown crops in years, because they make more money doing nothing at all.

25. Milissa Says:
    May 6th, 2008 at 10:45 AM

    Sorry, realize this is a little tangential to the larger discussion, but I just have to add a comment to #24. Let me start by saying that I was raised on a farm by people who were raised on farms (etc. etc.) for at least 6 generations, so I am very biased.

    It’s true that farmers sometimes get paid to not plant crops on their land. 100% true. But it’s not always a choice that the farmer makes. Where my family lives, there are county and state laws that actually prevent them from planting certain fields in certain years. So the argument could be made that such a program increases food costs by lowering the supply. The flip side to that is that those laws were actually put in place for environmental reasons. If you’re not planting a field, you’re not spraying anything on it and you’re not depleting the minerals in the soil: the field is busy growing lots of undergrowth and other “weeds” that are helping the soil to naturally remineralize, thus ensuring a bigger, healthier crop next year (theoretically). This is a good thing.

    Oh, and don’t let anyone tell you that supply in this country is the problem. This nation’s farmers supply enough food for the entire world every single year, if it were distributed in such a way (not advocating anything here one way or the other, just saying).

    Like just about everything else, there are always two sides to every story, and many times, there are closer to 100 sides!

26. keith Says:
    May 6th, 2008 at 12:29 PM

    Milissa, I was definitely over-simplifying my point there. You’re totally right about not planting in certain years to help the soil for future crops. And yeah, the laws make sense for doing so. That’s just good farming.

    But, there are a lot of investors out there now who intentionally buy set-aside farmland for the sole purpose of never growing anything and collecting checks from the government. So, the set-aside programs aren’t even helping many small farmers, as they were designed to. In some instances, set-aside land is more valuable than farm-able land, which makes no sense to me at all.

    And if people are blaming the higher cost of feed and other crops on ethanol, then logically one would think it’s a supply-side issue. If the issue really is transport, we’re totally screwed ;).

    The markets are insane for crops these days. How is it that soybeans more than tripled in price just after we all started calling them edamamme? (I have family who grow soybeans who were delighted;) ).

27. ashley Says:
    May 6th, 2008 at 02:27 PM

    in response to michele’s comments about the rising cost of food – have you guys looked into CSAs? There are several good ones around NYC, just hit up a sunday farmer’s market and ask around and you’ll stumble on one. I shared one a while back with a neighbor and it was definitely less expensive and more delicious than getting those organic, in-season, local veggies and fruits from Whole Foods or whatever. I am with you on the organic milk. there are terrifying statistics about the poor cows jacked up on hormones producing all that milk.

    in a broader sense, I wish this stuff was more out there. Many people regard organic milk tendencies as ‘crunchy’. It just seems so forcefully (and maybe blissfully) ignorant to be anything but shocked and motivated to change things when you learn about the way the world really is. we have our upton sinclairs, we’re just ignoring them.

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